Gary Sleeper - Ill Do My Own Damn Killin. Benny Binion, Herbert Noble, and the Texas Gambling War

I WOULD LIKE TO thank the staffs of the Dallas Public Library, Texas/Dallas History and Archives Division; the Texas Rangers Hall of Fame and Museum; and the University of Texas Arlington Special Collections Division. Without the assistance, advice, and expertise of these three fine organizations, this book would not have been possible.

Expurgated Excerpts of Conversations Recorded on
March 10, 1950, by Dallas Police Department

SHIMLEY: Ive been all over the country. Every place out there, just like I told you. Now, Ive made up with some people out there that own the big Flamingo hotelthis eastern outfit that owns that joint. Your name and his name [Binion] is the talk of the country. The man swears by the all God, and hopes that his five kids will all die, if he knows one thing about the whole proposition from start to finish. Now, Im just going to tell you what the facts are. They know where that Bowers bought the dynamite. They know the whole thing, and the himself claims he spent $10,000 on the investigation, and has it ironclad, and he hasnt had a thing, and swears and hopes his children will die if hes ever had one thing ever done to you in any way, shape, or form.

NOBLE: Now, I

SHIMLEY: I dont know, you understand, Im merely telling you what I know and what Ive been told.

NOBLE: Well, now

SHIMLEY: So now Dave Berman tells me

NOBLE: Who? Who?

SHIMLEY: Dave Berman. Owns the Flamingo hotel. You un derstand?

NOBLE: II know him. I

SHIMLEY: Now, Dave Bermansaid to me

NOBLE: Just take it slow, now.

SHIMLEY: He says, Shimley, he says, do you know this fellow in Texas? I says, Ive known the man twenty years.

NOBLE: Thats right.

SHIMLEY: I says I dont know a bad thing about him. I says that I dont know what in hell this thing is all about, Dave. He says, We dont believe out here this man is our friend. The mans got the sheriff, the police, the judgeshes got everything in the statethrough that outfit that owns everything there. And I says, Well, I want to tell you something, Dave. I dont know what the proposition is about. He says, Weve got people investigating it now, finding out through our sources of investigation, and

NOBLE: Whos he talking about?

SHIMLEY: Talking about you.

NOBLE: Yeh.

SHIMLEY: And he says, Well, why in the hell dont you get together and straighten this thing up? And I said, How in hell can I straighten it up? Do you know anybody thats connected with it? And I said, Yeh, I know a Jew boy down there thats his friend, that Ive known for fifteen years, too. He says, Whats his name? And I told him who his name was Phillip Stein. Well, he knows about [indistinct] and Jerry and them in the oil business, because hes got some oil leases with old Max Cohn, and things in Oklahoma. So he knows all about you, you understand. Now, how he knows about Phillips, I dont know. So I tell him, so he says, Well, why in the hell dont you straighten this thing up and get to the bottom of it? He says, it, and get that all stopped and kill those three down there in Texas. Not talking about you, talking about some other people, understand, connected with this Bowers, now Im telling you.

NOBLE: Who? Who are they? Tell me.

SHIMLEY: I dont know who they are.

NOBLE: Oh, you do know.

SHIMLEY: No, I dont. I dont know who they are, but I will know who they are, and I think he [Stein] can help me to find out.

STEIN: I dont want to be in on that.

NOBLE: No, no. Hes

SHIMLEY: And the name

NOBLE: No. Well, now, here

SHIMLEY: Here, let me show you something.

NOBLE: O.K.

SHIMLEY: Now, heres what this man saysnow after Dave gets him, and I talked to him. I said, Yeh.

NOBLE: What man? Whowho?

SHIMLEY: Dave Berman is the man that brought me in to Benny. Dont you understand? Cause I done talked to him. He offered

NOBLE: But Daves a big man out there.

SHIMLEY: Hes a big man out there. He owns the Flamingo hotel.

NOBLE: Ive known him through some friends of mine.

SHIMLEY: Now, nowon top of this, when we get to talking about it, he sits down at the table, me, him, and Dave, and two other people. He says, I hope my five children will die this minuteand holds his hand up like thisif I know one thing on earth about it.

NOBLE: Whowho said that?

SHIMLEY: Oh, Benny [Binion] said that, himself. Now, he said, Im going to get to the bottom of itthis whole thing, and Ive got people working on it now. Now, when I left there, I told him that I was coming to see Phillip, not you. Under stand what I mean? So that was my mission here, was to try to get you two to talk together over the telephoneand let me and Phillip go out there and Phillip straighten the whole thing out. And hes got to get in the middle of it, because hes your friend, and he cant do any more, and I dont do it by myself.

STEIN: No, Herbert.

NOBLE: No, thank you. Well, eveneven after that, the town is in such a mess, how in the hell you going to

SHIMLEY: Well, you and him know how to straighten it out.

NOBLE: I dont know

SHIMLEY: Well, by God, he said you could. Im telling you what the man said. Would you talk to the man over the phone?

NOBLE: Yes.

SHIMLEY: All right.

NOBLE: Yeh, get him on the phone right now. Ill talk to him.

SHIMLEY: Im going to tell you something. I done stuck my neck clear up to here. You understand.

NOBLE: Yeh.

SHIMLEY: Give me long distance, please. Yes, I want 3669W, Las Vegas, Nev. Nevada, thats right. [Indistinct whispering.]

SHIMLEY: Now, listen, Phillip, you are the only man that can help me with this proposition.

NOBLE: Now, if you evertell what name Im using

SHIMLEY: Say, listen, dont you worry about me man. Are you afraid of me, Herbert?

NOBLE: No, Im not. If I was, I wouldnt even be talking to you.

SHIMLEY: Listen, let me tell you something. You know what Ive done. Now, Im just telling you, I dont give a . Ive spent $6,500 on this.

NOBLE: I stillifunless he can do something with somebody herehow in the hellbut even at that, I dont see how

SHIMLEY: By gosh, he can stop it.

NOBLE: That man out yonder?

SHIMLEY: You aint kiddin. Hell stop it, or well kill all three of themone or the other. And you wont have to have nothing to do with it, either. You know that manI mean loves them kids just like you do your daughter.

NOBLE: Thats right, thats right.

SHIMLEY: He [Binion] stood like this, Phillip, and he says, I hope God will kill all five of them, now, if I know one thing about it, at all. He didnt only convince me, he convinced the biggest mob in the United States. If he wanted to get something done, he wouldnt have nobody do it like that. Ill tell you that.

NOBLE: I know he and Mickey [Cohen] are just like that.

SHIMLEY: One of the biggest outfits in the United States.

NOBLE: Thats right, thats right. O.K. I know hehes got a connection that wont quit. Hell, now, Im not calling him.

SHIMLEY: Im calling him.

NOBLE: Youre calling him.

SHIMLEY: Youre right.

NOBLE: Hell, say, I get

SHIMLEY: Hello, Mrs. Binion? Is Mr. Binion there? This is Shimleyhello, this is Harold Shimley, Harold Shimley. Yes, Id like to talk to him, please, if you can get him on the phone. Hello, Benny, this is Shimley. Well, Im in Dallas and I have done what I told you I thought I could do. And I think this whole thing can be straightened out 100 percent. And, of course, I know what Ive been told, and you know the whole score from start to finish. I know you wouldnt have spent $10,000 if you hadnt have known. I dont get that from you. I get it from the other people. And this is my friend, just like you are. Now wait a minute. I want you to talk to somebody a minute.